Monthly Archives: March 2017

Market Analysis: Stock Imbalance

Today’s post comes as a follow-up to a debate between Zippy and Deti in my post Market Watch. Given the amount of talking past each other, and the fact it was derailing that post, I decided a new one was appropriate. This post will let them, myself  and others answer the questions that were raised. At least, that is my hope.

I will begin by quoting a question that Zippy was trying to address:

What I am interested in is whether women who are trying to do the right thing have an easy time of it compared to men who are trying to do the right thing.

This was, in my view, the best example of that question which he raised. He put it several different ways, but I think that version is the easiest to understand.

Deti had his own set of questions:

  • if women really aren’t satisfied with all this casual sex they’re having, why are they having it?
  • If the casual sex they have is so unsatisfying and they want something else, what are they doing to change such that they don’t have to have all this unsatisfying casual sex (but continue to have, nonstop)?
  • And if casual sex is so unsatisfying, then what would satisfy them?
  • And if something other than casual sex would satisfy them more, why don’t they go get it? Or at least, why don’t they NOT do things they claim are so unsatisfying?

Any other questions they have, which they would like people to try and answer, they can mention in the comments below. I will bring them up here and mention them in the main post if I feel it appropriate.

With all of that out of the way, let me try and answer these questions myself.

Let’s begin with Zippy’s:

What I am interested in is whether women who are trying to do the right thing have an easy time of it compared to men who are trying to do the right thing.

His is fairly simple. I think the answer is that both of them have such a terrible time of it that it is impossible to tell who, if anyone, has it worse.

Something important to note is that Zippy is looking at the market as a whole, which effectively moves the real question to moral agency and the ability/likelihood of choosing what is good over what isn’t. It isn’t about who can marry, or even marry well. Just how easy it is do to what is right- which can include marrying or not marrying. With those parameters, I think men and women are on equally awful footing.

Now, if one were to alter Zippy’s question (and it would be an alteration), towards asking whether men or women have an easier time when it comes to marrying right, then my answer would change somewhat.  In the past I have said that women had it easier. However, as time has passed I’ve reconsidered this. Originally it was a more significant advantage comparatively, although insignificant in an objective lens. it lessened over time, with teh advantage mostly owing to the lower number of marriage-worthy women as compared to men (again, comparatively- absolute numbers are something else). Nowadays I am not sure this is true. Enough men might be dropping out of the market entirely that this has changed.

Now to try and answer Deti’s questions. I will tackle them in order.

  1. A lot depends on the meaning we attach to “satisfaction”. And of course, who we are talking about. However, if we assume just temporary sexual gratification, and women as a general aggregate, then women probably are getting some satisfaction. However, it is not to the level of what they want. They want more satisfaction. Remember, they are women- only the best will do (I jest, I jest). As for why they have it- because they are fools, and to borrow a metaphor, they are throwing good money after bad. They don’t know where else to look for true satisfaction/fulfillment.
  2. They are trying to weed out as many unworthy men as possible from the SMP. Oh, and they are also trying to sabotage each other, too.
  3. Fried Ice. No, in all seriousness the answer depends on who we are talking about again. If it is women as an aggregate, it would be to have a top tier men all to herself. And to be able to toss him if bored or he loses top tier status.
  4. Many possible answers. Perhaps they are lazy. Perhaps they don’t know, or cannot think of anything other/better. Maybe I should let this one go…

And with that, I leave the floor open to others to take there stab at these questions, and related ones.

Who has it harder in the marriage market: devout and serious minded Christian men, or devout and serious minded Christian women?

Can we even tell? And does it even matter?

Go ahead and add your own.

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Filed under Marriage, Marriage Market Place, Men, Moral Agency, Red Pill, Sex, Sexual Market Place, Sin, Temptation, Women

Deep Strength’s Advice On How To Make It Happen

DS has a new post up that I think is appropriate and worthwhile reading given the overall discussion taking place in various parts of the Christian ‘sphere at this time. He calls it Make it happen. Go on over and give it a read. I might offer some of my own thoughts later if time permits.

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Selected Sunday Scriptures- #128

Today’s first passages comes from the book of Sirach. I was inspired to use it thanks to this comment by Gunner Q about how daughters should be viewed as a potential liability. He is not the first to make this observation:

A daughter keeps her father secretly wakeful,
    and worry over her robs him of sleep;
when she is young, lest she do not marry,
    or if married, lest she be hated;
10 while a virgin, lest she be defiled
    or become pregnant in her father’s house;
or having a husband, lest she prove unfaithful,
    or, though married, lest she be barren.
11 Keep strict watch over a headstrong daughter,
    lest she make you a laughingstock to your enemies,
a byword in the city and notorious among the people,
    and put you to shame before the great multitude.

(Sirach 42:9-11)

An exchange started to develop in my most recent post. Lest it get any worse, I quote from this part of the gospel of Matthew as a refresher course:

Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye.

(Matthew 7:1-5)

Finally, these words of hope in the Lenten season:

16 From now on, therefore, we regard no one from a human point of view; even though we once regarded Christ from a human point of view, we regard him thus no longer. 17 Therefore, if any one is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has passed away, behold, the new has come. 18 All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 that is, God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. 20 So we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We beseech you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. 21 For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

(2 Corinthians 5:16-21)

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Market Watch

In my previous post, A Poor Example,  I mentioned a post that Scott and Elspeth wrote about how June Cleaver might be unmarriageable right now. What I want to do with this post is make a series of observations based on what they mentioned in their post, as well as in the comments. I will likely expand on it over time, as I have a chance to re-read the comments. This won’t be an in-depth post, but rather more of a list with perhaps a comment or two of my own.

So here are some of my observations:

  • The Market for devout Christians, men and women alike, is awful. I wrote previously on this topic in my Market Failure series of posts. You can read Part 1, Part 2 and Part 3 via the links. As for who has it worse, I think that is mostly an academic exercise. My gut says men more than women, but not by a huge amount.
  •  Geography play a huge role in the difficulties of the marriage market right now. Different geographic locations are more or less favorable to men or women. My suspicion is that where I live the ratio between marriageable men and women heavily tilts to men, and that of course makes the market tougher for men.
  • Demographics also plays a significant role. As various Christian groups have splintered, and there is even more separation in belief within groups, the overall pool of eligible mates has dropped precipitously. So while absolute numbers might be up, the actual pool is perhaps smaller than it has been for perhaps even centuries.
  • Most Christian parents are not raising devout Christian children. Much less marriageable ones.
  • Young men are much less interested in marriage than they were in the past. Having a few more years under my belt since I started blogging, I have seen this more and more. Younger men are just less interested in marriage. The why of this is worthy of a whole post of its own.
  • Too many people are doing too little to make marriage happen these days. Marriage needs to be a matter for the whole community.

 

Also, the answer to this:

Is it possible that parents of the last several generations, responding to the cultural cues from blue-pill pastors and other sources have raised both sex children to be pretty useless at “traditional” marriage, and therefore a different approach to finding matches for them may be required?

…is yes and yes.

More to come as I think on it.

Update: A few more observations-

  • The market is seriously hampered by the amount of deception going on. The worst lies, from what I have seen, tend to be those that people tell themselves. Self-deception makes hit harder to diagnose problems, among other ills.
  • Introverts and shy people are especially vulnerable in the market right now. Given how few effective venues there are for meeting eligible mates, each one has to count that much more. For introverts, that is much more difficult.
  • I am among the most the most “pro-marriage” of guys in the Christian manosphere. At least as it applies to my own life. Only a couple might be at the same level as me, such as Deep Strength. I don’t know if that was the case originally, but it seems to be the case now. And even despite my subjective “gun-ho” approach I am still very cautious.

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Filed under Courtship, Femininity, Hypergamy, LAMPS, Marriage, Marriage Market Place, Masculinity, Men, Moral Agency, Parenting, Red Pill, The Church, Tradition, Women

A Poor Example

I have been reading with some interest this post over at Scott’s blog. The comments in particular have made for fascinating reading. It has been something of an encapsulation of years of discussion in the ‘sphere in just one comment thread.

I am still trying to put together my own response to the post. My suspicion is that it will result in several separate posts, as there is a lot to cover. But before I go there, I want to make an observation about myself and my own writing.

One of the problems in my writing that has plagued me since the beginning of my time in the ‘sphere has been projection. I have projected far too much of myself into assessing how others (mostly men), would act or react in different situations. That is a problem because, as the post title suggests, I am a poor example.

I am abnormal. Heck, even for the manosphere I am abnormal. I am an outlier among outliers. Which means, frankly, that any advice I give is suspect if it is based on an assumption of what a man other than myself would do.

This has held me back from a lot of writing, especially when it comes to advice. I used to do that often in the beginning. With all of that in mind, I won’t bother trying to give advice any more. I don’t think it can really help anyone.

However, I would like to think that I am good at analyzing systems. So when I get a chance I will try and apply that skill to what is discussed in Scott’s post and comments.

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Looking Back- What A Bleak Ride

As of late I have been reviewing a lot of my old posts, especially from the first few months of blogging. In so doing I have been struck by the differences in what I wrote about, and cared about, back then as compared to now. It has been an interesting experience to see how much change I’ve experienced or gone through since then.

Man, have I become cynical. I had plenty of dark posts in the past, but there were still plenty where I evidenced some hope I might be able to work some change in the future. Those are pretty much gone now. Nowadays I have been given up any notion of actively making a difference in society, and frankly, I am cynical about even making a difference in any particular church.

I don’t cover “Game” or technique, or whatever you want to call it, anymore. It has been ages since I have given it any serious mention. Partly this is because much of the ‘sphere has moved past that. But also partly because I don’t see much point in it in the first place. What good is it to learn such things when it won’t help you?

I also haven’t been doing as much systematic analysis as I used to. A lack of time plays a role here, for sure. But I also think I don’t see it as making any kind of difference.

I could probably go on, but I think I’ve made my point. What I am curious about is what I might be able to discern about myself if I keep going through old posts until I get to my most recent ones. Perhaps there is a pattern to be found there. If I had to guess, it would be a greater trend towards faith and spirituality, and living in an age of wickedness.

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For Old Time’s Sake

Vox’s most recent post caught my eye when he mentioned this:

I noticed a long time ago that while I still have pretty much the same friends that I did in high school, virtually no woman I knew hadn’t changed out her entire set of friends more than once. There are exceptions, of course, but it does seem strange that the supposedly social sex tends to be less inclined to maintain lasting friendships.

That got me thinking about the differences in friendship between men and women. As I thought it over, I came to the realization that I have never heard a woman do something for a past friend “for old time’s sake.” I’ve only ever heard that language, and behavior, from men.

I’m curious if any of my readers have noticed the same as well. Perhaps it is simply my limited experience, and thus limited data set. Or maybe there is something to this.

If it is “a thing”, then I wonder if it might have to do with male notions of honor and obligations. Perhaps for women it might also have to do with their more pragmatic (in theory) natures, especially when it comes to relationships.

So please folks, chime in and let me know what you think.

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