A Validation And A Warning

Vox at Alpha Game tipped me to this article a few days ago. I couldn’t resist addressing it myself. He quoted the money part, and so too will I:

My husband has a life that many people who are “rule-followers,” like me, would envy. When I first met him, it was undeniably a passionate love affair. I’d never dated anyone or known anyone like him before. He took risks, lived all over the world, had many passions and has been a loyal friend. He’s seven years older than I am, and we met at work, where his power and seniority at the office was insanely attractive to me. The year we got married, he wanted to take a risk and go back to graduate school to find his dream job. I trusted his judgment, and between his savings, my new job, and some sacrifices, we comfortably lived while he went through two years of graduate school. My husband now has his dream job. I’m proud of everything he’s accomplished and what we were able to do together to make it happen.

Over the past four years, my career has skyrocketed in ways I never could have dreamed of. I’ve broken through the hypothetical glass ceiling in a male-dominated industry. I am a huge believer in women in the workplace and always will be. If they become the breadwinners in marriage, more power to them.

Now herein lies my problem — I became the breadwinner in an extreme way. I committed to supporting us for two years, but we’re going on four now, and it will likely be five. Our income divide is so extreme that I pay for 90 percent of our living expenses. What I’ve found is I can’t live this girl-power lifestyle that I believe in.

I’m very close to a breaking point, and I never stop thinking about leaving my husband. And no matter what other reasons I come up with, it always leads back to money, power and sexual attraction.

This sordid tale is yet further validation of my LAMPS/PSALM model. In particular we see the role of Money/Status (they are often linked) in affecting sexual attraction. The woman here was drawn to her husband because his M and S values were high, both in general and compared to hers. However, the shift in their job situations has altered the equation dramatically. Now he makes much less than her. And as a result she finds him much less sexually attractive.

Ouch time.

I feel sorry for this guy. He bought into modern egalitarian thinking, and believed that his wife really would be ok with this change in breadwinner status. And he is probably going to lose his marriage as a result.

This brings us to the lesson…

Men: marry down, not up.

Be wary about letting your woman take your place as breadwinner. Perhaps she won’t be as bad as this woman here, but it will not be easy on her. Her nature inclines itself against this model, and you don’t want her to fight that throughout your marriage. Even if it lasts, it is a recipe for misery.

That isn’t to say it cannot be done, but I caution men all the same against it.

There is wrath and impudence and great disgrace
    when a wife supports her husband.

(Sirach 25:22)

Edit 1: This post went live before I had intended. So instead of trying to integrate additional thoughts above, I will make them here instead. This will likely involve several edits over time.

I mention above that men should marry down, not up. That is of course the first step. The second step, just as important, is to stay above her in social rank. That dream job you’ve always wanted? Well, if it lowers you in relation to her… you just might want to give it a pass. Sure she may say she is ok with it, but what her conscious and unconscious minds want can be two entirely different things.

Of course, life has a way of messing with that plan. And if you do find yourself on the down angle, you will have to adapt. Hypergamy is a trait all women share, but some seem to keep that more under control than others. If you do decide to marry in this age (a risky proposition to be sure), keep an eye out for that kind of woman. Again, it isn’t necessarily the end of the world if you find yourself outside breadwinner status. But it does mean you will need to step up the rest of your game in maintaining sexual attraction.

Edit 2: Something else which I hinted at above was that this woman was especially affected by Status and Money. It is worth remembering that no two women are exactly alike. While each is influenced by one of the LAMPS/PSALM factors, the prominence of each factor will vary from woman to woman.

What I am curious about is how one should go about using this info. Should some women be avoided based on their preferences? Should a man try and figure out which factors influence a woman most? How do you even go about figuring it out? Food for thought.


Filed under Alpha, Attraction, Blue Pill, Marriage, Red Pill, Temptation, Women

15 responses to “A Validation And A Warning

  1. This guy did marry down.

    [DG: Correct. See my update.]

  2. Bottom line: Women don’t want to financially support a husband. Makes them feel like their husbands’ mothers, not wives, and not lovers. Women look down on men they have to support financially. They certainly don’t want to have sex with such men.

    [DG: I am not at all convinced about that last part. Plenty of women support their men, and find them sexually attractive. It is just that they tend to be on the lower side of the MMV scale.]

  3. https://markdriscoll.org/sermons/3-marriage-myths-3-spirit-strengths/

    Much as I hate to use Driscoll as an example of anything marriage-related, cue this video up to about the 11:00 mark. The rest of the sermon is standard Blue Pill men-are-all-morons evangelical pablum, but Driscoll makes a very interesting point in illustrating the differences between a contractual marriage and a covenantal marriage. He is of course oblivious to his anti-male, blameless-sinless-female undertones (or else he not-so-deftly dances around the idea), but he completely misses the fact that in our present Hypergamous social order a covenantal marriage is just as susceptible to that order than any other arrangement.

    This post is an excellent example of this. A covenantal marriage is no insulation from Hypergamy, and it gets worse when that man’s sense of self and understanding of spirit is wrapped up in a never-ending quest to satisfy Hypergamy and God to live up to a distorted ideal of being a man in a covenantal marriage. Add the fact that ‘the world’ is set against him in this and a legal, divorce industry, and social world are ready to devour him if he doesn’t live up to the Holy Hypergamy, well, you can see where that leads.

  4. Post released before I was finished. Going to try and do that quickly.

  5. Rollo, I might be misinterpreting you here… but I am not offering this warning in order for men to fulfill some sort of God-given masculine duty. This warning is a matter of self-preservation. As you point out, the world is against every married man in the West at this point. Hence, they need all the help they can get. No woman is immune from Hypergamy, and Queen Hypergamy in this culture (or Holy Hypergamy as you label it) is a tyrant every married man must be wary of.

  6. MK

    it always leads back to money, power and sexual attraction.

    Dude’s a loser. Roissy would toss her some Skittles, tell her to STFU, and give her a spanking. And she would be hot for him again. Or dump her first.

    Women fall for social-status-preselection very easy. A fast car/good job actually means something to a woman. So it’s alpha or bust for men.

    Rollo, A covenantal marriage is no insulation from Hypergamy, and it gets worse when that man’s sense of self and understanding of spirit is wrapped up in a never-ending quest to satisfy Hypergamy and God to live up to a distorted ideal of being a man in a covenantal marriage.

    No. Men living out a real covenantial marriage (big families, in community) have no issues. Modern hypergamy? Feminism + lack of extended family + lack of children + lack of community. Seen many Amish women wandering about looking for love? Didn’t think so. I’ve never seen a true covenential marriage (traditional religion, large family, woman at home, no media) fail yet.

    I’ve also never seen a woman with 4+ kids and no TV having hypergamous sweats. They are too busy living life as it was meant to be lived. The modern female world is merely going extinct, and women are reacting to their certain genetic death. They are wise to do so. There is no mystery here.

  7. feeriker

    “Queen Hypergamy in this culture (or Holy Hypergamy as you label it) is a tyrant every married man must constantly battle.”


  8. Tigersault

    Neve understood for the life of me why a man would feel ok with his wife making more than him; beyond obviously loss of SMV, what about loss of pride? You’re supposed to support your wife financially, not the other way around

  9. Well, since she’s the breadwinner, when she decides to punch the clock, maybe she’ll wind up paying a good chunk of it to him:

  10. What I am curious about is how one should go about using this info. Should some women be avoided based on their preferences? Should a man try and figure out which factors influence a woman most? How do you even go about figuring it out? Food for thought.

    I think that if you notice that a particular woman is most attracted to you because of your status and/or money, and you want to keep her attracted to you, then don’t quit your high paying high status job before retirement. If you would rather do something that doesn’t pay as much or give you as much status, then pick a woman who is more attracted to you because of your personality (Power) or your looks, and who won’t care if you don’t have a high status high paying job, and won’t mind living a more modest lifestyle.

    As for figuring out what a particular woman prefers, I guess just pay attention to what traits you’re strongest in at a time when you notice her being very attracted to you, and that’ll give you an idea to start with.

  11. Joyce

    Hi Dalrock! I cannot relate to the attraction aspect, but if they can learn to live only on the husband’s income, then the couple can save the wife’s income for a year. If she earns four times as he does, they can save a lot in a year. Afterwards, she can resign, get pregnant, and take care of their children at home.

  12. @ Chris

    Yup, that’s what I was saying elsewhere discussing that article. He should just try to stretch out the marriage as long as possible so as to get maximum alimony when she does divorce him. He’ll be able to have the career of his dreams while being paid for by his ex-wife.

  13. @ Joyce

    I am actually Donal, not Dalrock. No worries, just wanted to clarify.

    And what you say makes sense. The thing is, these are people for whom material comfort has obviously become an idol (especially her, it seems). What you suggest would be abhorrent to hedonists like that, and thus sure to be rejected out of hand.

  14. Novaseeker

    I think what Cassie has said makes sense — you need to understand why she’s attracted to you, and maintain that. This guy messed up because he dropped the aspects of what made him attractive to her, and that is basically killing off her attraction to him. Now, he appears to have chosen a woman who is quite hypergamous ( I agree that not all women give in as fully to it as others do ), which leaves him in a quite precarious bind at this point because it will really be nigh on impossible for her to be attracted to him sexually unless he radically changes his career/finances again now.

    In any case, one of the “iron rules” in my book is that you MUST maintain the same SMV differential in marriage as you had when you attracted your spouse. If you do not, trouble is coming at you, no matter what. So if the man is +1 SMV, and that is based on his work power and status, then he has to maintain that to maintain his +1 SMV. If he loses that power and status, and his SMV falls relative to his wife, trouble almost always ensues because wife then loses attraction. SImilarly if he stays where he is while wife improves her SMV by 1 (however she does, but normally for women it’s through some kind of appearance upgrade), there will also be trouble unless he can find a way to increase his own SMV relative to hers so as to maintain the same +1 SMV differential. Mess with that delta and you’re looking for trouble.

    Here it was kind of a double effect because as he got less power and status, she got more, so even if he had “stayed still”, she still likely would have found him less attractive due to the fact that his power and status were now very close to hers, or perhaps even the same as hers, so it would have been an SMV hit for him anyway. The moral of that story is that if you have attracted a particularly hypergamous woman who is herself also a hard charging business type, you keep that foot down on the accelerator until you’re 70, and you don’t ever step off. If you, she will probably catch you, and it’s curtains for you and her hypergamy at that point.

  15. Kate

    I’ve “supported” my husband for three years now, so I think I can provide some insight on when it is possible. Though, to be perfectly honest, there was some kicking and screaming (on my part) at certain times, the fact that the situation (not the lack of capability of being a higher earner) was at fault made it eventually the ideal. I go about my work in such a way to provide us with income and health insurance, while my husband manages us. He directs our shared interests while continuing to participate in the culture war and be my mentor and guide. Our common disinterest in “the world” makes him the ideal spiritual partner. He is able to live apart from it, and one day I will too. Just as our relationship was temporarily long-distance, this temporary female sole breadwinner status is coming to an end. While I will still work for my own future benefit, his hard work in his earlier life will sustain him and benefit us. We have even managed to accomplish much more than survival in these years by scooping up a property we’ve restored for my daughter and settling his child support case. All on 52-55K a year and a lot of faith. Surely, God has watched over and protected us every step of the way. As far as choosing a wife, you need to choose her parents. My daughter is nearly ten and I have determined a path for her to earn a true MRS degree. She will study child care at a votech school during high school, then attend a local college for either culinary arts, massage therapy, or both. The result will be home-building skills with the ability to work outside the home with the potential of up to three certifications. A wife who can make a contribution when needed or desirable is the right balance to seek.

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