Creepy or Hawt?

[Caution, minor profanity in this post.]

Tonight you’re all gonna be part of a social experiment…

Reader Donald R. has clued me in to a video that I think encapsulates a lot of Game/Red Pill concepts. However, rather than have you watch it straight away, I want to conduct aforementioned social experiment. I would like my readers to watch the video twice. The first time, watch it WITHOUT the sound. That’s right, turn off the sound on your computer before watching the video the first time. Then, write down your initial results, including:

1) What do you think is happening?

2) What do you think is being said by the men?

3) What do you think is being said by the women?

4) What is your impression of each person in the video?

AFTER you have done that, watch the video WITH the sound. Then write what you think now. Post both your initial and your final thoughts on the video in the comment section below.

WARNING: DO NOT WATCH WITHOUT CHECKING INSTRUCTIONS ABOVE!!!

Once I get enough comments I will throw my own into the mix, and explain my intentions with this post.

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47 Comments

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47 responses to “Creepy or Hawt?

  1. thehaproject

    Initial thoughts:

    1) What do you think is happening?

    Guy 1 is being friendly to the girls. – They respond badly. Girl 1 mocks Guy 1

    Guy 2 (more attractive, better dressed) hits on girl, she really likes him,
    she responds well, heads off with attractive guy, after confirming with her friend.

    Guy 1 is sitting there and sees that Girl 1 is full of shit.

    2) What do you think is being said by the men?

    Guy 1 invites to spend time, Girl 1 makes up bullshit.
    Guy 2 invites to spend time, Girl 1 drops her panties.

    3) What do you think is being said by the women?

    Girl 1 makes up bullshit, faux polite, to Guy 1.
    Girl 1 and Girl 2 laugh about Guy 1’s audacity in approaching them.

    Girl 1 responds well to Guy 2, laughs and engages.
    Girl 1 tells Girl 2 how excited she is about Guy 2.

    4) What is your impression of each person in the video?

    Guy 1 seems like a nice, but not aggressive/confident guy.
    Guy 2 is a confident man who is used to getting what he wants.

    Girl 1 is a lying bitch.
    Girl 2 is a bitch who should be in jail for assault.

    Final thoughts:

    Yep.

  2. thehaproject

    Great comment over at Vox’s place on this video:

    Trust said…

    “The first guy wasn’t a nice guy, he was pretending in an attempt to score. The second guy on the other hand was considerate enough to find out her favorite drink, her fashion preferences, and her cycle to spare her the embarrassment of him initiating at ‘that time’.”
    –thus spaketh the Hamster

  3. femininebutnotfeminist

    ~ no sound:

    At first I thought guy # 1 and girl # 1 seem to know each other and are maybe just saying hello, since he walks away smiling (as in no hurt feelings over being turned down). But then based on the girls’ facial expressions they seem to be talking bad about him, so maybe he was hitting on her, and he reacted graciously (for lack of a better word) to being turned down? Based on girl # 1 and guy # 2’s facial expressions, he is laying on the charm to pick her up (classic PUA) and, after consulting with girl # 2, she takes the bait. Girl # 2 is crazy for using mace on guy # 1 when he isn’t physically attacking her.

  4. Without sound:
    Guy with no game and no sense of style walks up to women. Gets shut down with obvious frosty behavior on the women’s part. Walks away.
    Guy with style and charisma walks up. Has game with confident body language that closes off the rest of the bar.

    With sound:
    hilarious.
    The first part is fairly typical of anyone that’s ever approached a woman in a bar. Ever. The reaction like this was never a ‘majority of the time’ thing for me, but was the most common. Probably around 40%, but I will admit I was selective in who I’d approach rather than be an approach machine. The talking after is normal, and I’ve heard women do that before you even get out of hearing range.
    Second part starts off fairly normal. Over the top satire, but not too far either. If you took out the obvious “I’m a stalker” afterthoughts he throws in, it’d be believable. A stalker that simply didn’t supply where he got the info, but played it off as a “I just know” or “You seem like a person who likes….” or “I bet you’d look good in red….” would be perfect.

    I’ll be honest in that I’ve used facebook to softly segue-way into topics like that myself. It’s a tool and a place you can pick up conversation topics and info that would have been supplied via social circles in a more traditional society. It works wonders for the man that wants a few fall back topics to talk about OR a man who has an intention of leading the woman into a certain train of thought. Knowing she had a good time doing something yesterday allows you to bring the topic up, relate to it, and use the memory you invoked to graft yourself into that memory a little bit or associate yourself with good feelings even if she never links you to the memory itself. The original PUA’s would do that with simple gifts that meant nothing to them, but they made a story and a fun emotional high when they gave it to the woman. Short term memory is engaged which can develop into long term over time.

    Anyways, back on topic.

    The clip effectively states that the right men can do or say anything while still getting sex, and the wrong men can do no right.

  5. femininebutnotfeminist

    ~ with sound:

    WOW are these girls dumb and mean! They act like guy # 1 is creepy when in reality guy # 2 is a psycho-stalker-pervert and guy # 1 is totally normal! They should have used the mace on guy # 2 for stalking her like that (that is creepy, and potentially unsafe for her as stalkers sometimes become killers too ~ too many Lifetime movies?).

  6. FBNF:
    I’m glad you can have a glimpse of the life of a man approaching women (minus the mace). Every time you see someone approach and talk to a stranger, realize that he’s dealt with this multiple times. Or, even worse, he’s about to get it for his first time…

  7. femininebutnotfeminist

    @ leap,

    Thank you, I’m glad to learn something from the male perspective, but not glad that this sort of thing actually happens. I have never been to a bar, but if I were that girl I would have spent time talking with guy # 1 (it’s not like he was trying to get a ONS, that I know of) and would have told guy # 2 to take a hike (or maced him to let him know that he had better keep his psycho-stalker self away, or else!). But that’s just me.

  8. All respect to FNBF: the typical woman would have done exactly as the women did in the video. If you had gone in with the intention of drinking and meeting someone, then “typical woman” includes you. Going in with the intention of analysis, you might have been more objective. (And yes, Guy #1 is trying to get a ONS.)

  9. 1)What do I think is happening?
    The guy is probably asking the girl if she wants a drink or something to chat, I don’t know. All I heard at the end was “have a good day?”
    2)What do you think is being said by the men?
    They are probably trying to initiate conversation with her.
    3)What do you think is being said by the women?
    They’re probably insulting the first guy (when he walks away) and obviously flirting with the second.
    4)What is your impression of each person in this video?
    Not surprising. They first guy is awkward and kind of shy. The two women are very fake. Smiling and grinning and then grimacing the next. The second guy, seems cocky.

  10. femininebutnotfeminist

    @ Caspar,

    With all due respect to you as well, I’m not exactly your typical woman… I don’t do ONS’s, no matter if the guy is the best looking thing to ever walk the earth; I’ve never had a drink or been to a bar (I don’t know what I would do under the influence of alcohol, and I’m not willing to find out); the only guys I quickly and automatically turn down are the obvious PUA’s who I know are only after one thing (with the recent exception of a middle aged man who reeked so much of alcohol that I had to hold my breath to keep from throwing up). I realize most (not all) women these days would do as the video showed, and it’s awful really.

  11. *Correction: For #1, I assumed I heard have a nice day. At least, that I what I mouth read.

  12. LOL haha. That is really funny, but also true. That second guy was creepy…omg…

  13. My thoughts were similar to everyone else’s. HHG and I were laughing after we watched it with the sound on.

    Watching it with the sound made me feel sort of empathetic toward men who have the burden of doing a lot of the approaching. That would stress me out so bad. I don’t know how ya’ll do it.

  14. I had my roommate watch this and we both responded to the first guy as “awh, that is so nice,” (this is before we saw the second guy–who was a serious creep by the way). I agree, guy #1 over guy #2 anyway. That guy looked like he could be one of those psycho path murderers anyways.

  15. Deep Strength

    This is satire but there is some truth to it.

    Body language is a HUGE part of being a confident and assertive man.

  16. First impression –

    Sorta Nerdy Guy walks up and tries to hit on girls. Rejected somewhat politely and walks away without causing any drama.

    Second guy walks up and hits on girl. She responds well. some flirting and some (very likely suggestive) banter. Girl walks off with Studly McSeedplanter. Her friend is left by herself, wondering where her own Studly is. Sorta Nerdy Guy says something, re-announcing himself on her radar, triggering DANGER ALERT. She maces SNG, who politely consents to pass the #!@#&$ out.

    I had to kind of force myself to watch this “straight.” I go into a type of “deconstructive mode” with experiments like this. I half expect when watching with sound I’ll discover it’s a laxative commercial, or an ad for Lemon Pledge (I imagine it stings when sprayed in your eyes).

    Second impression –

    I’d almost say it’s an SNL skit, except I think I’ve seen a slightly less exaggerated version of this play out in the past a time or two. Especially the part where a woman freaks just ’cause a guy she found “creepy” (who wasn’t even trying to hit on her at this point) dared open his mouth within a mile of her.

  17. FuzzieWuzzie

    Thanks for posting this. First impression with sound off was #1 failed, no drama. #2 succeeded. Sound on was altogether awful. Why do self respecting men put themselves through this nonsense?
    Now, I have new youtube channel to watch.

  18. deti

    +1 to Leap, Nov 20, 2:30 am.

    His comment is steel on target.

    Without the over the top from Guy #2, this happens All. The. Time. This happens dozens of times at every bar, every meeting place, every party, every restaurant, every church, in every city all across the land, every single day, for decades. Every guy – EVERY guy – has been rejected and blown out of the water by some girl he’s really drawn to. And every guy has seen the nice girl go home with the douchebag who we know is going to have sex with her and not call her the next day. We put up with rejection on orders of magnitude more than women do.

    Of course, it doesn’t help that most guys are like Guy #1: no game, no style, little confidence, slumped shoulders.

  19. deti

    Interesting.

    Caspar makes a cogent comment; FBNF predictably responds with NAWALT and IANLT (I Am Not Like That).

  20. femininebutnotfeminist

    Deti, please don’t start. I said IANLT and NAWALT because it happens to be true, and when someone tells me that I would do XYZ when I simply would not, of course I’m gonna say IANLT, regardless of whether or not it is the norm (which I know it’s not). Please, I am BEGGING you to just leave it at that.

  21. deti

    FBNF:

    I’ll end it by saying that if in fact what you say is true, then you are an outlier, an aberration, and truly are not typical.

  22. Redpillnewby

    FBNF,

    Even if you’re NLT, and technically (<100%) NAWALT, THIS IS THE NORM.
    EVERY guy has experienced this nuclear rejection when approaching women they are interested in, often even several times.

    This happens in churches all the time.

    It has happened to me, and I've watched it happen to several other great guys as well.

    Women don't want to know men who don't act like guy #2 from the very first time they meet, and then they convince themselves that he's a wonderful person worth their time and attention. They treat men like guy #1 badly, because they don't know him, don't want to know him, are more concerned with their own status (opinions of friends), and are never taught/held accountable to treat others well. Women think NAWALT because they don't even remember all the men like guy #1 they've treated that way. They only remember how "nicely" men like guy #2 treated them, and how positively they reacted to him in turn.

  23. But “Sorta Nerdy Guy” was cute and the other guy was not (my sound is messed up on my laptop so I never got to hear it with sound) – I’m gathering from the comments that “other guy” was actually creepy?

  24. I meant “watch it with sound”. Going back to work now.

  25. femininebutnotfeminist

    @ Deti,

    I have been an outlier since middle school, though I never understood why. So if this is the reason, then I take what you said as a compliment, so thank you.

    @ RedPillNewby,

    I understand as of late that this sort of behavior is typical. I was just saying it’s not how I would have responded (or do respond).

    If anyone else wants to comment to me about the IANLT \ NAWALT subject, please do it via email [REDACTED] as we have unfortunately gotten way off subject. Donal is doing an experiment and we should get back to that. (Sorry for thwarting your thread Donal, it wasn’t my intention.)

  26. It might have been Sunshine Mary or Judgy Bitch, I know it was a female blogger who said it, essentially, “The only thing that makes you ‘Not Like That’ is acknowledging that, yes, you are ‘Like That’.”

    The woman is not allowed to teach in the assembly precisely because she is deceived, the primary deception being, “but *I* am not like that. No, really.”

    The two chicks in the video, were they to watch it objectively, maybe with their own faces blurred out, would themselves comment something like: How could they do that! *I* would never fall for that creepy #2 stuff like *those* bar sluts!

  27. femininebutnotfeminist

    @ Caspar,

    What do you want me to say? That yes I would agree to a ONS with a guy like Mr. Suave McHunky when I have always done the exact opposite? That yes I would blow off Mr. Friendly McNormal without even giving him a chance when I have always done the exact opposite? I can’t say either of those things without lying. Also, while I fully admit to being very naive and oftentimes very deluded, I do know better than to fall for a very obvious PUA (regardless of how studly he is), though I do have to weed out the more subtle ones.

  28. Redpillnewby

    “How could they do that! *I* would never fall for that creepy #2 stuff like *those* bar sluts!”

    This is the “logic” that most Christian women use every day.
    “*I* would never _______ like *those* _______!”

    Anytime, they see behavior in other women that they/others don’t approve of, they automatically separate themselves from *those* people/behaviors, because they want to preserve their own reputations, and don’t want to wear the same labels they assign to others.

    They want to believe they are totally different than *those* other “bad” women, because they know others don’t approve of ______, and they don’t really want to look in the mirror to find out how similar they usually are to *those* women.

    Women who really are NLT are often the ones honest and brave enough to look in the mirror to find out how capable of *those* “bad” things they really are (or could be). Rather than distancing themselves from “bad” people/things that lower their status in order to protect their own reputations, they pause to reflect how likely they may be to think/do those same things themselves under the same circumstances. If they are honest, they will realize they might not be so different from most “bad” women after all, the only differentiating factors being circumstances and opportunity.

    But, those women are pretty rare.

    * I’m not accusing FBNF of being LT (and she might not be), but I do think she would be wise to examine her heart for any similarities she might be unaware of. *

  29. theshadowedknight

    The first impression was that Nice Guy went up and made a pass and was turned down. They talk about how he is weird, creepy, possibly rapey. The Tall Dark Stranger came along and talked some smooth game and got her to come along after they have a giggle. NG gets maced because he is a creeper.

    The second time around, I was right about everything but how much of a stalker the TDS was. NG is soft and it shows in his approach, in his stance, and in his voice. The women talk about what a bad person he is because he is not attractive. The TDS comes over and although he is stalking her like mad, he does not violate the rules(be attractive, do not be unattractive) and so he gets to take her home and do whatever he wants–which given his apparently predatory nature, is probably not wholesome.

    Obviously, it is satirical, so it goes over the top. However, satire is used to explore and question reality, and there is plenty of it in this video. Note that even the unquestioned assumptions–meeting in a bar, immediate escalation to intercourse, the setting itself–are reflections of the state of the culture.

    The Shadowed Knight

  30. femininebutnotfeminist

    First of all, I never called them “sluts”. Second, I have examined this part of my heart many times. Even before becoming a christian, I wasn’t “that girl”, and it wasn’t for lack of opportinity either. In middle school, when others were at least claiming to be hooking up with each other, I just wasn’t. I could not bring myself to do it, even when propositioned by the guy almost every girl in my class wanted (and to be honest, I wanted him too). But even then I wholeheartedly believed sex should be saved until marriage, so I refused him. The same with a second guy. I quickly gained a reputation for being a “prude” because I wouldn’t “put out”, and not one guy… NOT ONE… persued me all through high school. At times I considered being “that girl”, both before and after becoming a christian (at 19 years old), because I very much didn’t and don’t want to end up alone, but those thoughts only last for a matter of minutes before I come to my senses and nip them in the bud. As for the nice guys, they didn’t start asking me out until my early 20’s, and I have always given them a chance. I save the nuclear rejections for the sleezy PUA’s who make it very clear what they are after. I don’t claim to be NLT in many areas, but in THIS area, having examined my heart many times and deciding it just wouldn’t be worth it to be “that girl”, I can honestly stick to my guns and say IANLT.

  31. Redpillnewby

    FBNF,

    You may be one of the rare ones then!
    Thank You!

    [Ed: You seem to be using a bunch of different accounts, which is forcing me to manually approve each of your comments. Either stick to an account or I will stop confirming your comments.]

  32. Ton

    I figured it was a spoof and it was.

  33. femininebutnotfeminist

    @ RedPillNewby,

    Your welcome 🙂 and thank you for believing me, as few people around here seem to!

  34. theshadowedknight

    Your welcome and thank you for believing me, as few people around here seem to!

    FBNF, this is for two reasons. One, we see all sorts of women on the regular claim that they Are Not Like That. Then they promptly prove that they Are Like That. Two, You ALT. You came into the thread and turned it into a discussion about you, because AWALT. Even You ALT, as is usual.

    The Shadowed Knight

  35. So what did I intend here? Well, I wanted to show a couple of things.

    1) Deep Strength is correct, body language is critical to male attractiveness. Without sound this becomes even more apparent. This falls under the Power component of LAMPS, as one’s body language is a significant indicator of Masculine Power. What Lovelyleblanc7 described as cocky is just one example of a confident frame. Despite female protestations otherwise, it is what they want and crave, as evidenced by the men they shower attention on.

    2) Closely related to the above point is that body language, or how you say something, is often times more important than what you say. Now, this is pure satire in the video, but the truth is that a man can get away with saying a lot with the right frame. Danny from 504 makes a habit of discussing how he says the silliest/stupidest things, but girls don’t mind. Why? Because he has a strong frame.

    3) Nice Guy, or Guy #1, showcases what Leap of Beta explained above:

    a glimpse of the life of a man approaching women

    Understand, rejection and failure is part of life. But women have made it unnecessarily cruel for most men these days. For all the talk about men being shallow, and superficial, and concerned with how “hot” a woman is, women are just as bad if not worse. Short men especially seem to draw out the cruelty in women to a degree that is shocking, even after you know to expect it.

    Watching it with the sound made me feel sort of empathetic toward men who have the burden of doing a lot of the approaching. That would stress me out so bad. I don’t know how ya’ll do it.

    Increasingly, men aren’t. Women have become so cruel that many men are giving up on women, and going their own way. Frankly, I don’t blame them.

    As strange as it may seem, this is all connected to the central theme of Mary Shelley’s Frankenstein. You see, the worst monsters are the ones that we create ourselves. And women, having become abhorrent creatures, are pushing men further and further to the fringe. Eventually they will be forced off the map. But women have forgotten, if they ever truly knew, that age old wisdom of cartographers: Once you go off the edge of the map, here be monsters…

  36. Regarding AWALT and IAMLT…

    Something to keep in mind is that AWALT when it comes to base drives and behaviors. Certain reactions and impulses are pure biology, and can’t be helped.

    On the other hand, wisdom and discernment can allow a woman to rise above her base nature (just as the same can apply to men). The key is for the woman to understand her base nature, to accept it, and to strive at all times to master it, lest it master her.

  37. theshadowedknight

    Monsters…

    Reading that for the first time was a fascinating experience–and enlightening. I recommend you all get to know it.

    The Shadowed Knight

  38. earl

    Before Sound:

    1) first guy talking to gals looks normal, wearing normal clothes…when he leaves the gals talk about his bad game behind his back. Second guy is confident, dressed well, educed tingles in the gal.

    2) First guy complimented them too much…was try hard
    Second guy was confident…probably didn’t say too much, a bit of a jerk

    3) First guy…they tried to act nice, then talked badly behind his back
    Second guy…she was flirty, her girlfriend gave her the green light to go get defiled

    4) Impression…girls are being girls, first guy is a beta, second guy is cool

    After sound:

    Yup.

    So in conclusion..

    1) Be handsome.
    2) Be attractive.
    3) Don’t be unattractive.

  39. earl

    “WOW are these girls dumb and mean!”

    Tell me about it…but that’s the new reality guys live in.

    When I go to bars, it is to drink and watch the tv…I don’t pick up on ladies. But I eavesdrop on ladies conversations. 9 times out of 10 the subject of what some nice guy did to them comes up. You know that horrible, life scarring event about him wanted to get to know her and coming off as a creep.

  40. earl

    “I don’t know how ya’ll do it.”

    After you’ve been in battle enough…rejection becomes nothing.

  41. earl

    Although I will say this….the more guy #1 is rejected like that…the more he becomes #2. Your heart becomes more calloused and you get to the point that you say whatever you want to say to women and could care less about her reaction.

    Seriously…when I treat girls like nothing they eat it up, like something…they don’t. And you are ALT until proven otherwise.

  42. As Leap said, the second guy is over the top to make it funny, but not by that much. If he’d just left the red dress “guess” as a mystery and stopped there, it would have been perfectly realistic that she’d go with him. Like the other guys here, I’ve seen it over and over, and even lived both sides of it thanks to learning game.

    I’ve done the polite approach thing, the gifts thing, the poetry thing, the white knight thing, the staying up all night listening to her problems thing, and gotten rejected for them all. On the other hand, one time after learning game, during my first phone conversation with a particular girl, I asked her, “So, spit or swallow?” (No, I’m not proud of that.) She just giggled and went on chatting. But here’s the best part: when we went for a drive a few days later, I didn’t make a move, and she blew me off after that. The lesson: imply that she’s an oral specialist and she’s putty; be a gentleman and she’s gone. And no, she was by no means an outlier.

    As for NAWALT: of course they’re not. Some have more restraint than others. But a girl wearing a miniskirt and a tight scooped top, leaning back against the bar putting her goodies on display for all to enjoy? Yes, she most certainly is Like That.

  43. earl

    Another point the video addresses…

    When you ask your girlfriends for advice or what decision you should make…they never look out for your best interests.

    And a man should NEVER ask a woman for advice on pretty much anything…especially relationships.

  44. DJ

    When I watched it without sound the first guy seemed polite and the woman seemed to want to get rid of him asap without outright cruelty. The second guy idk but his body language was not quite right it was subtly fishy, the chick eats it up but from her body language it seems to be against her better judgement.
    With sound I saw my assumptions where accurate except that first guy was even more polite. And second guy was actually a very creepy character.
    Also the friend was pretty crumby

    Going to bars seems lame

  45. Marissa

    Monsters…

    Reading that for the first time was a fascinating experience–and enlightening. I recommend you all get to know it.

    theshadowedknight, you linked to the general Monster wikipedia page. I’m curious what you’re referring to–is it the short story collection by A.E. van Vogt?

  46. theshadowedknight

    The part you want to read, Marissa, is the synopsis at the top, before the list of contents. The origin and roots of the word and its connotations. Monsters are more than they seem.

    The Shadowed Knight

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